Watching old competitions got me thinking.
I also have some questions for the historians and experts on this board, please help.
1. The phenomenal amount of changes in this sport - Is enough time given to the athletes and coaches to adapt?
2. Is Bruno Grandi the gymnastics equivalent of "David Brent" or for Americans "Michael Scott" from "The Office"?
IF I got any dates wrong below please correct.
Also sorry if the post seems long but I have included headings if someone only wants to read certain parts.
The changes like the qualifications system to the Olympics e.g. test event, and the changes to the EGR for each apparatus got me thinking about everything that Bruno & his buddies have done to the sport over say the last 20 years.
For decades 70's, 80's 90's there was not much change. I know more World championships were held (from 4 years to 2 years then every year) but for the most part the sport remained the same apart from 1996 Olympics when 7 gymnasts could compete at the Olympics instead of just 6. In 1997 the age rule was also changed and gymnasts had to be 16 by years' end rather than 15.
The number of gymnasts competing has been cut down every 4 years and now there will be more changes for Tokyo.
1960's/1970's/1980's/1992 Olympics - 6 gymnasts per team and compulsories.
Team Finals 6-up-5-count.
1996 Olympics 7-up-6-count and compulsories.
1997: Age limit upped by one year and FIG got rid of compulsories.
World and Europeans Team size is 6.
2000 Olympics: Team down to 6 members and Team Finals 5 up 4 count.
2001: Worlds & Europeans: 3 up 3 count system introduced for team finals.
2004 & 2008 Olympics: 6 on a team and 3 up 3 count
World and Europeans still follow this format.
2012 Olympics: Team down to 5. TF still 3 up 3 count.
Worlds stay at 6 per team, Euros down to 5.
2016 Olympics: Team still 5. TF still 3 up 3 count.
Worlds & Euros stay as before
2020 Olympics: Team down to 4. TF 4 up 3 count.
2 additional gymnasts from each country can compete for event finals.
Reason? Teams cut from 6 to 5 to make way for more individual slots but I think FIG should have fought this issue with the IOC.
Also the TF 3-up-3-count format: While some like it I can't stand it. It's not fair if a gymnast gets injured, there is no "safety - net". I also think that if Grandi thought that this current format allowed teams from non-powerhouse countries to medal it hasn't worked so far.
I know Australia medalled in 2003 TF but wasn't that because China was fined? And I know that this year UK medalled in TF but this is 14/15 years after this format was introduced. While I am delighted for the girls on the bronze team Russia did make some uncharacteristic mistakes.
I really don't know can we look at just one result of GB winning bronze and claim that 3-up-3-count is a success from this point of view. All other years the top 4, and, certainly the top 3, at least in WAG have been USA, RUS, ROM, and CHN.
Also the open ended scoring.
I'm not really sure there was anything wrong with the 10 system. Just because one incidence in 2004 Olympics happened where Nemov wasn't rewarded for increased difficulty on the high bar I'm not sure it justifies bringing in a new scoring system. FIG just used that as an excuse. No offence against Nemov but he knew that there were only so many marks the judges could give him anyway.
I've said in several threads that competitions are getting boring with the winners being a foregone conclusion. Whoever has the highest difficulty and reasonable consistency is guaranteed a win. There are very few surprises.
While the artistry had been declining even before 2006, I feel that this code does very little to reward it.
EGR - Floor:
Floor used to have more rules about double somersaults, front tumbling and combination tumbling.
I don't know when all these were enforced but now the rules have been relaxed somewhat there is less variety of tumbling on floor e.g. double layout, double back pike and double tuck all in one routine. Why were these rules revoked? Doesn't it show more mastery to be able to combine different skills?
Vault:
I know gymnasts have to do 2 vaults in Event Finals. That hasn't changed as they are specialists.
Up to 1996 Olympics: Athletes used to do 2 vaults for TF (and AA?) and the best was chosen (remember Moceanu and Strugg in Atlanta?).
2000 Sydney Olympics:
For AA: Gymnasts had to do 2 and the vaults were averaged. Not sure about TF.
Now I need some help here but did these 2 vaults have to be different or the same?
2004 Olympics gymnasts did 1 vault in TF and AA.
Now for Event Finals the vaults could be both backward or forwards e.g. Rosu won with Amanar and DTT.
From 2005/6 on the vaults for EF then had to be in a different direction meaning that gymnasts had to learn a new vault in a hurry if they didn't happen to have 2 vaults, one forwards and one backwards. e.g. Sacramone already had a Rudi and a DTY whereas Pavs had to learn a forward vault (at least that is what I read).
Now this rule is gone from 2013 (?). Why bother to bring it in the first place?
Qualification for the Olympics:
I am very glad that there is a test event. However why was this not brought in sooner? Did the IOC try to get FIG to introduce Test Events?
If a gymnast didn't come from a country that had a chance to qualify for a team spot then how did they qualify in the past?
Didn't FIG encourage event specialists but they couldn't qualify for the Olympics? For example Pegan from Slovenia had competed for years yet has never been to an Olympics (he has retired now). In 2007 only gold medallists from World Championships event finals could qualify for Beijing 2008 then this was changed to all medallists for 2011.
All-Around/Event-Finals
Also the FIG's constant change from AA to EF and back to AA. For example by having 6 on a team but in 3 up format a country could have a good selection of AA'ers and event specialists. Now FIG is limiting a team to 4 where they have to be All-arounders leaving event specialists out of a team medal. What is the reason for this?
I appreciate that all sports evolve and sometimes for a very good reason. But I can't think of any other sport which has so many changes in such a short space of time.
Have all the changes made the sport more popular? Is it making it more fair on the athletes and coaches?
What do you think of all the changes to gymnastics?
I also have some questions for the historians and experts on this board, please help.
1. The phenomenal amount of changes in this sport - Is enough time given to the athletes and coaches to adapt?
2. Is Bruno Grandi the gymnastics equivalent of "David Brent" or for Americans "Michael Scott" from "The Office"?
IF I got any dates wrong below please correct.
Also sorry if the post seems long but I have included headings if someone only wants to read certain parts.
The changes like the qualifications system to the Olympics e.g. test event, and the changes to the EGR for each apparatus got me thinking about everything that Bruno & his buddies have done to the sport over say the last 20 years.
For decades 70's, 80's 90's there was not much change. I know more World championships were held (from 4 years to 2 years then every year) but for the most part the sport remained the same apart from 1996 Olympics when 7 gymnasts could compete at the Olympics instead of just 6. In 1997 the age rule was also changed and gymnasts had to be 16 by years' end rather than 15.
The number of gymnasts competing has been cut down every 4 years and now there will be more changes for Tokyo.
1960's/1970's/1980's/1992 Olympics - 6 gymnasts per team and compulsories.
Team Finals 6-up-5-count.
1996 Olympics 7-up-6-count and compulsories.
1997: Age limit upped by one year and FIG got rid of compulsories.
World and Europeans Team size is 6.
2000 Olympics: Team down to 6 members and Team Finals 5 up 4 count.
2001: Worlds & Europeans: 3 up 3 count system introduced for team finals.
2004 & 2008 Olympics: 6 on a team and 3 up 3 count
World and Europeans still follow this format.
2012 Olympics: Team down to 5. TF still 3 up 3 count.
Worlds stay at 6 per team, Euros down to 5.
2016 Olympics: Team still 5. TF still 3 up 3 count.
Worlds & Euros stay as before
2020 Olympics: Team down to 4. TF 4 up 3 count.
2 additional gymnasts from each country can compete for event finals.
Reason? Teams cut from 6 to 5 to make way for more individual slots but I think FIG should have fought this issue with the IOC.
Also the TF 3-up-3-count format: While some like it I can't stand it. It's not fair if a gymnast gets injured, there is no "safety - net". I also think that if Grandi thought that this current format allowed teams from non-powerhouse countries to medal it hasn't worked so far.
I know Australia medalled in 2003 TF but wasn't that because China was fined? And I know that this year UK medalled in TF but this is 14/15 years after this format was introduced. While I am delighted for the girls on the bronze team Russia did make some uncharacteristic mistakes.
I really don't know can we look at just one result of GB winning bronze and claim that 3-up-3-count is a success from this point of view. All other years the top 4, and, certainly the top 3, at least in WAG have been USA, RUS, ROM, and CHN.
Also the open ended scoring.
I'm not really sure there was anything wrong with the 10 system. Just because one incidence in 2004 Olympics happened where Nemov wasn't rewarded for increased difficulty on the high bar I'm not sure it justifies bringing in a new scoring system. FIG just used that as an excuse. No offence against Nemov but he knew that there were only so many marks the judges could give him anyway.
I've said in several threads that competitions are getting boring with the winners being a foregone conclusion. Whoever has the highest difficulty and reasonable consistency is guaranteed a win. There are very few surprises.
While the artistry had been declining even before 2006, I feel that this code does very little to reward it.
EGR - Floor:
Floor used to have more rules about double somersaults, front tumbling and combination tumbling.
I don't know when all these were enforced but now the rules have been relaxed somewhat there is less variety of tumbling on floor e.g. double layout, double back pike and double tuck all in one routine. Why were these rules revoked? Doesn't it show more mastery to be able to combine different skills?
Vault:
I know gymnasts have to do 2 vaults in Event Finals. That hasn't changed as they are specialists.
Up to 1996 Olympics: Athletes used to do 2 vaults for TF (and AA?) and the best was chosen (remember Moceanu and Strugg in Atlanta?).
2000 Sydney Olympics:
For AA: Gymnasts had to do 2 and the vaults were averaged. Not sure about TF.
Now I need some help here but did these 2 vaults have to be different or the same?
2004 Olympics gymnasts did 1 vault in TF and AA.
Now for Event Finals the vaults could be both backward or forwards e.g. Rosu won with Amanar and DTT.
From 2005/6 on the vaults for EF then had to be in a different direction meaning that gymnasts had to learn a new vault in a hurry if they didn't happen to have 2 vaults, one forwards and one backwards. e.g. Sacramone already had a Rudi and a DTY whereas Pavs had to learn a forward vault (at least that is what I read).
Now this rule is gone from 2013 (?). Why bother to bring it in the first place?
Qualification for the Olympics:
I am very glad that there is a test event. However why was this not brought in sooner? Did the IOC try to get FIG to introduce Test Events?
If a gymnast didn't come from a country that had a chance to qualify for a team spot then how did they qualify in the past?
Didn't FIG encourage event specialists but they couldn't qualify for the Olympics? For example Pegan from Slovenia had competed for years yet has never been to an Olympics (he has retired now). In 2007 only gold medallists from World Championships event finals could qualify for Beijing 2008 then this was changed to all medallists for 2011.
All-Around/Event-Finals
Also the FIG's constant change from AA to EF and back to AA. For example by having 6 on a team but in 3 up format a country could have a good selection of AA'ers and event specialists. Now FIG is limiting a team to 4 where they have to be All-arounders leaving event specialists out of a team medal. What is the reason for this?
I appreciate that all sports evolve and sometimes for a very good reason. But I can't think of any other sport which has so many changes in such a short space of time.
Have all the changes made the sport more popular? Is it making it more fair on the athletes and coaches?
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